Lotus Pond game

[emalafeew]

Lotus Pond is finally available on VZfit!  It's our most comfortable VR game and our most relaxing.  

What you do is pedal a kayak around a lake.  The day, dusk, night, and dawn happen.  There are fish, ducks, and grandmas that feed them.  If that's all you want to do, peace out.  But there's also a game in there for hyper-competitive folks.

During the day get ducks to follow you and drop them off at grandmas around the lake for score. They'll follow when you come near or you can throw food to get them come a bit farther. The more ducks that follow you, you get progressively more score, but it's also easier for them to get snagged in weeds or for the grandmas to disappear at dusk.

At night, the fish glow and you see underwater gems. Throw food in the water to lead them around the good/blue gems and avoid the bad/red gems.

It doesn't support multiplayer yet, but when it does you'll see that players are big pandas, because pandas are fun to hang with.

[VirVoom]

It's good that you're adding games. But moving anywhere is frustratingly slow and it's quite a tame game concept. You're good at the artistry but to me what matters is quality of gameplay. Sorry to have to be negative.

This would be fun if you sped the kayak up by a factor of 5 or 10, and added a machine gun, velociraptors that dive bomb you, and huge dino crocodiles that stalk you. And ideally add rapids with rocks to navigate.

[emalafeew]

It's good that you're adding games. But moving anywhere is frustratingly slow and it's quite a tame game concept. You're good at the artistry but to me what matters is quality of gameplay. Sorry to have to be negative.

This would be fun if you sped the kayak up by a factor of 5 or 10, and added a machine gun, velociraptors that dive bomb you, and huge dino crocodiles that stalk you. And ideally add rapids with rocks to navigate.

Hahaha!  Great ideas

Yeah this game was very intentionally meant to be a relaxing intro to VR.  It was part of our first collection (VirZOOM Arcade) but the last to be ported to VZfit due to level of optimization.  

I'm sure we could make a more insane version of this as another Kayak level.  Everybody always wants to shoot the ducks, and like the idea of gators that stalk you at the same time.

We've also heard requests for a rapids level.  It would just reuse the Kayak in an infinite runner-type environment, where you need to avoid rocks to keep up your speed and avoid crashing.

[VirVoom]

Yes, I'm aware you're trying to cater for a variety of interests and users including those who struggle with VR, and maybe some people who just want peace and quiet. I'll give it another go but I think it's at the wrong end of the intensity spectrum for me. So far 'keep flying' is the most intense and it's still way below the level I'm used to in video games (and I'm not a gamer), so hopefully an intense game/level is in your sights. River run seems well suited for an intense level to be added..?

[Shon_T]

Yes, I'm aware you're trying to cater for a variety of interests and users including those who struggle with VR, and maybe some people who just want peace and quiet. I'll give it another go but I think it's at the wrong end of the intensity spectrum for me. So far 'keep flying' is the most intense and it's still way below the level I'm used to in video games (and I'm not a gamer), so hopefully an intense game/level is in your sights. River run seems well suited for an intense level to be added..?

Yeah...I mean...if you have ever run a river IRL...you really have to fight against the current to avoid the rocks... it could be a pretty fun experience...especially if done right.

[VirVoom]

Ok, so I'm going to try to explain to you that my issue with most of the games is how much they engage you mentally.

I just spent 30 mins in River run which is supposed to be one of the intense ones, and it's just too easy. I virtually never get shot. There's long periods of doing nothing but waiting to arrive at something. And if you set it to hard and run out of fuel you just restart the level but I always set it to easy as that way it's slightly less slow. After 20 mins play you get to shielded turrets but they aren't really fun, you just introduce additional waiting. Same with winterstan.. it's slow for ages, travel is slow, waiting for enemies is slow, and eventually you get a level where you lose, often because you stopped paying attention. Cali rally - just doesnt engage your brain. Curvy racer was ok for a few days but there's no actual downside to coming last and soon enough you realise that the robot cars just match your pace so you just go fast at the end and always win.

By contrast Jailbreak is one of the best games because it keeps your mind active with having to track and follow the bandits, and if you mess up you have to do it again. But I've played it for so many hours now and it's very repetitive.

So the point I'm trying to make is that a game doesn't need to be a vomit inducing rollercoaster or aeroplane simulator to be fun. The gameplay just needs to require constant attention and for example small course corrections, and there has to the right amount of penalty for getting it wrong. That's one thing about Keep Flying which makes it more engaging - the fact that there's a real penalty to pay if you slip up.

So, that's why the launch of kayak was a frustration, since it's got everything that annoys me in the various virzoom games, all in one game.

So, if you do create a more intense game next (and I'm hoping you will), in my opinion it's not so much "VR intensity" that's needed, but rather gameplay intensity.

[Stain2319]

I'm a gamer myself, so I agree with much of what you're saying. I think one of the things that the Virzoom guys try to do is to skew gameplay a little more in the direction of getting a 'traditional workout' vs. just game-playing. I think, for example, that they changed it so being killed in the tank games doesn't actually kill you and end your game, because people didn't like interrupting their workout.

I can see both sides. Pure speculation on my part, but I suspect that people who are already serious about cycling workouts and who already have expensive bikes and trainers are more willing to shell out the money for an Oculus and the monthly fee and those folks may want to work out more than they want to play games.... just a guess though.

[VirVoom]

I struggle to believe that people have invested to join VirZoom without wanting either indoor relaxation or fun. And the 50:50 ratio between explorer and game use suggests many people joined because they want it to make exercise fun and/or distract them from the fact they are exercising. So, I do think the quality of gameplay is really important.

To take a positive tack, I'll just suggest what I think would make for a good game, but without talking about what mode of transport it involves, because I don't think that matters an awful lot and it's a distraction.

I'll start with what to avoid: Since some people struggle with intense VR, crazy aerobatics is probably out. Some people are seated forwards or use elliptical trainers so lengthy and sharp turns are best minimised. Again anyone with an elliptical trainer will massively hate having to aim precisely (they simply can't aim accurately due to the body motion) so maybe avoid having small targets to aim at.

And the difficulty I think is 'ok what's left then?'. And I think theres two answers 1. "having to constantly plan ahead". And 2. "The right sized penalty for messing up".

Planning ahead could mean a lot of things. It could involve lots of minor course corrections. For example if racing a spaceship through an asteroid field, it's not about massive sweeping turns, but rather many small course adjustments made well ahead of time.

Similarly planning ahead could mean planning how and when to fire a weapon, taking into account the speed of the weapon (like in winterstan the gun turns slowly) or speed of the bullets (so if you've got a machine gun with tracer rounds you'll need to aim the weapon 'ahead' of where the enemy is moving to. Or in a game where you're a mouse escaping a cattery you'd point your laser pointer strategically to draw the cats out of your way.

Whatever needs to be planned ahead, it's important that the user has to be continually planning ahead so their mind is constantly focussed.

As for the penalty for messing up, it has to be significant. Keep Flying is at the upper end of the spectrum - maybe even too much because it's demoralising to touch the ground 2/3rds into your game. Curvy racer is at the bottom. Jailbreak is probably just enough.

So by designing the game such that you need to really have your wits about you to avoid losing, and giving a real incentive to do so, you achieve an excitingly intense game without having to risk causing VR sea-sickness.

I hope this is all useful to the development team and not taken negatively!

[emalafeew]

All our users appreciate VR immersiveness and control over their navigation as the bedrock we've built for pedaling motivation. That in itself constitutes a largely subconscious mental distraction, for the same reason that people hike, race, and ride in real life.

Beyond that, we've seen people fall into different camps. Some want straight workout and progress features, others want more gameplay, others want a peaceful diversion. Some play the same way all the time, others feel a different way every day. Some play for 10 minutes at a time, others for an hour or more.

So we intentionally created a range of games with less and more gameplay (as you've noted) as well as less and more VR intensity, that you can play for as little or long as you want.

We're happy to hear your suggestions for more overtly engaging activities and gameplay. Our team has designed and built games for quite a while, so feel we're learning more now about what fitness users want, and won't stop making improvements in both directions.

[Shon_T]

Have your developers considered more social networking/multiplayer type of games? I mean...I know even 'Head to Head" matches can be difficult to find at times, but wouldn't it be cool to ride with a larger group of riders like ZWIFT? or have a group race with multiple real world opponents? A "Mario cart" type race that allows you to target opponents to slow them down, or to gain "power ups" might add some fun too. 


Tank battles or Helicopter battles might take on new meaning if they were team based two on two or 4 on 4. New modes like Capture the Flag, "team escort" , "Capture the checkpoint" or Battle Royale would add replay value when you are playing against multiple opponents, and still engage folks in an open ended sandbox that would allow for heart pounding exercise.